Doctor Who: 2.2 Tooth and Claw
Apr. 24th, 2006 07:40 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
selenayA couple of days late for the review, but better late than never :-)
The first thing that has to be noted is the pre-credits sequence. It was absolutely amazing and definitely not something that I'd usually expect from the BBC. I could see the influences of recent martial arts films like Crouching Tiger, but they did it really well. The fight was beautifully choreographed and they'd filmed it with just the right pace and style. Definitely the best episode opener yet - it caught the eye and pulled you straight into the story.
Having noted that, I also have to note the effects for the werewolf because, yet again, they outdid themselves on it. A lot had to do with the way they shot it - you know that they don't have a movie budget for the CGI work so they used it sparingly to stunning effect. The quick cuts and off-screen moments worked in their favour, making the werewolf scarier by implication rather than overuse. When the werewolf was there, though, it looked far more realistic than I could have hoped for. I'm going to have to be a slightly disloyal Harry Potter fan and admit that they did a far better job with this werewolf than they did with Sirius in Prisoner of Azkhaban.
Having 'ooh'ed over the special effects, I turn to the important parts of the episode.
While this was definitely a better episode than last year's second episode, it didn't quite stand up to 'The Unquiet Dead' as Victorian era episode comparison. For the most part, this was another fun romp that really didn't need to be any deeper than that.
For the most part. The final few minutes were intriguing and revealed a few interesting things. The most curious was Torchwood - set up to investigate unearthly happenings and oppose the Doctor if he reappears? Now that puts a completely new slant on Torchwood from what I'd been assuming it would be and could make this an even more interesting premise that I'd originally thought. I was also intrigued by Queen Victoria's rather abrupt change of attitude to science and myth - did she in fact absorb something from the wolf's scratch that changed her?
I read the Doctor and Rose's discussion of the possibility of haemophilia in the royal line as a light-hearted "what if..." discussion, but it does raise some interesting possibilities for that time-line.
I've been a bad reviewer and already taken a gander through some of the other comments on this episode and found numerous discussions of the possibility that the Doctor and Rose are being set up for a big fall. On the evidence of this episode, I have to agree. They almost seemed high on the danger and excitement, forgetting the consequences of what was happening. There was almost a fangirly moment between them in the library when they realised it was really a werewolf they were facing. If they're being primed for a fall, then it's going to be a big one.
I'm adoring the relationship between this Doctor and Rose. There's sparkage galore but they're also settling into the kind of friendship where everything is wonderful because the other person is with them. This is definitely turning out to be one of my very few het ships, although I'm wondering whether we'll ever examine the way that their relationship has also changed. Is part of that fall going to be to do with that?
One of my favourite moments from this week has to be:
"Am I being rude?"
"Yes."
"Oh. It's pretty! Very pretty!"
The quote is probably a little off, but that's the essentials and I loved that moment. The Doctor being aware that he can be absorbed in what he's doing so that he'll say things that might not be right and needing to check with Rose. It was another really nice moment between them.
Rose is learning to take charge a lot more. She's always been one of the more capable companions, but I like the fact that she's not waiting around for the Doctor to rescue her and encouraging the others who are trapped in the barn with her to rescue themselves. The only slightly off moment, for me, was the overuse of their bet that she could get Queen Victoria to say "we are not amused". It was funny the first couple of times, but when they were being chased by the werewolf and Rose had seem someone torn apart in front of her, it didn't seem like something the earlier Rose would have said. Other the other hand, this could be part of that over-confidence that is starting to show through and could be addressed in whatever RTD and co. have planned for later in the season.
One of the other things that I really liked about the episode was Lady Isobel and her household finding the mistletoe themselves and putting together what it would do. I enjoyed seeing characters who would often have just been werewolf-fodder given some initiative and the ability to save themselves and others.
Another of my favourite moments in this episode happens again in the library, where the Doctor turns around, puts on his glasses and announces that the library is their arsenal. It was a really cool moment and I really adored the 'power to the geeks' kind of shout-out. I definitely need to icon that moment :-)
Of course, introducing himself as "Doctor James McCrimmon" had me giggling with daft delight - it was a great shout out to the original series. Looks like RTD is a lot more confident in it this year because he seems to be putting in more continuity with the original than he did last year.
All in all, I enjoyed this episode a lot and it definitely will stand up to repeat viewing. Not quite in Empty Child/The Doctor Dances league (although those are going to be very hard episodes to mathc), but still very good.
And next week's trailer has me very excited and impatient :-)
I'm watching Ghostlight, one of the Sylvester McCoy and Ace stories, and I'm thoroughly enjoying it. Doctor Who always has had a penchant for Victorian settings...
The first thing that has to be noted is the pre-credits sequence. It was absolutely amazing and definitely not something that I'd usually expect from the BBC. I could see the influences of recent martial arts films like Crouching Tiger, but they did it really well. The fight was beautifully choreographed and they'd filmed it with just the right pace and style. Definitely the best episode opener yet - it caught the eye and pulled you straight into the story.
Having noted that, I also have to note the effects for the werewolf because, yet again, they outdid themselves on it. A lot had to do with the way they shot it - you know that they don't have a movie budget for the CGI work so they used it sparingly to stunning effect. The quick cuts and off-screen moments worked in their favour, making the werewolf scarier by implication rather than overuse. When the werewolf was there, though, it looked far more realistic than I could have hoped for. I'm going to have to be a slightly disloyal Harry Potter fan and admit that they did a far better job with this werewolf than they did with Sirius in Prisoner of Azkhaban.
Having 'ooh'ed over the special effects, I turn to the important parts of the episode.
While this was definitely a better episode than last year's second episode, it didn't quite stand up to 'The Unquiet Dead' as Victorian era episode comparison. For the most part, this was another fun romp that really didn't need to be any deeper than that.
For the most part. The final few minutes were intriguing and revealed a few interesting things. The most curious was Torchwood - set up to investigate unearthly happenings and oppose the Doctor if he reappears? Now that puts a completely new slant on Torchwood from what I'd been assuming it would be and could make this an even more interesting premise that I'd originally thought. I was also intrigued by Queen Victoria's rather abrupt change of attitude to science and myth - did she in fact absorb something from the wolf's scratch that changed her?
I read the Doctor and Rose's discussion of the possibility of haemophilia in the royal line as a light-hearted "what if..." discussion, but it does raise some interesting possibilities for that time-line.
I've been a bad reviewer and already taken a gander through some of the other comments on this episode and found numerous discussions of the possibility that the Doctor and Rose are being set up for a big fall. On the evidence of this episode, I have to agree. They almost seemed high on the danger and excitement, forgetting the consequences of what was happening. There was almost a fangirly moment between them in the library when they realised it was really a werewolf they were facing. If they're being primed for a fall, then it's going to be a big one.
I'm adoring the relationship between this Doctor and Rose. There's sparkage galore but they're also settling into the kind of friendship where everything is wonderful because the other person is with them. This is definitely turning out to be one of my very few het ships, although I'm wondering whether we'll ever examine the way that their relationship has also changed. Is part of that fall going to be to do with that?
One of my favourite moments from this week has to be:
"Am I being rude?"
"Yes."
"Oh. It's pretty! Very pretty!"
The quote is probably a little off, but that's the essentials and I loved that moment. The Doctor being aware that he can be absorbed in what he's doing so that he'll say things that might not be right and needing to check with Rose. It was another really nice moment between them.
Rose is learning to take charge a lot more. She's always been one of the more capable companions, but I like the fact that she's not waiting around for the Doctor to rescue her and encouraging the others who are trapped in the barn with her to rescue themselves. The only slightly off moment, for me, was the overuse of their bet that she could get Queen Victoria to say "we are not amused". It was funny the first couple of times, but when they were being chased by the werewolf and Rose had seem someone torn apart in front of her, it didn't seem like something the earlier Rose would have said. Other the other hand, this could be part of that over-confidence that is starting to show through and could be addressed in whatever RTD and co. have planned for later in the season.
One of the other things that I really liked about the episode was Lady Isobel and her household finding the mistletoe themselves and putting together what it would do. I enjoyed seeing characters who would often have just been werewolf-fodder given some initiative and the ability to save themselves and others.
Another of my favourite moments in this episode happens again in the library, where the Doctor turns around, puts on his glasses and announces that the library is their arsenal. It was a really cool moment and I really adored the 'power to the geeks' kind of shout-out. I definitely need to icon that moment :-)
Of course, introducing himself as "Doctor James McCrimmon" had me giggling with daft delight - it was a great shout out to the original series. Looks like RTD is a lot more confident in it this year because he seems to be putting in more continuity with the original than he did last year.
All in all, I enjoyed this episode a lot and it definitely will stand up to repeat viewing. Not quite in Empty Child/The Doctor Dances league (although those are going to be very hard episodes to mathc), but still very good.
And next week's trailer has me very excited and impatient :-)
I'm watching Ghostlight, one of the Sylvester McCoy and Ace stories, and I'm thoroughly enjoying it. Doctor Who always has had a penchant for Victorian settings...
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no subject
Date: 2006-04-24 08:59 pm (UTC)I entirely missed that, because all I heard was "Doctor J[intelligable] McCrimmon" and didn't know that was Jamie's last name. Once I knew that, though, it was very cool :)
I loved the fighting monks - although mostly because it meant they spent most of Confidential talking about fighting and showing up sword fights :)
And next week's trailer has me very excited and impatient
I'm so impatient I dreamt the whole episode last night. I don't remember most of it, although it mostly involved the Doctor and Sarah Jane talking a lot, and it was only towards the end I realised there had been no Anthony Head, no monsters and no school :) But I did love the moment in the trailer where he says 'Hello Sarah Jane' in a tone of voice that suggested he'd done something wrong. I'm interested to see how they handle her working out who he is, and him reacting to her.
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Date: 2006-04-25 04:45 pm (UTC)*g* I don't know how I absorbed that snatch of trivia, but I knew the last name so I spotted it immediately.
Once I knew that, though, it was very cool :)
Wasn't it just? They're making old-school fans happy with those kinds of references as well as giving everyone fantastic new episodes!
I'm so impatient I dreamt the whole episode last night.
*snort* And I thought I was impatient because I'd wished for it to be next Saturday already. Hope the dream was good, though :-)
I'm interested to see how they handle her working out who he is, and him reacting to her.
That's one of the things that I'm really looking forward to. She's been through regenerations before, so the idea that he could be the Doctor won't be a problem, but I'm really looking forward to seeing how the interaction and those first moments play out.
Is it Saturday yet?
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Date: 2006-04-25 05:15 pm (UTC)You only have to wait till Saturday - I'm at a friends party in London, so won't get to see it till Sunday!
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Date: 2006-04-26 08:19 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-04-26 10:35 pm (UTC)It's in a pub, so no. And it's with people I haven't seen for a while so I'm really looking forward to catching up. Doctor Who can keep. Although since I'm seeing Sylvester McCoy in the theatre in the day, it'll be almost like I'll have seen some DW on Sat :)
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Date: 2006-04-27 08:53 am (UTC)Did I ever tell you that I saw Peter Davidson and Sylvester McCoy in panto together when I was 18? My best friend took me along as a surprise Christmas treat :-)
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Date: 2006-04-27 10:40 am (UTC)I must remember to take the binoculars. And hang around the stage door afterwards :)
Did I ever tell you that I saw Peter Davidson and Sylvester McCoy in panto together when I was 18?
Wow, that's very cool. I had no idea either of them had ever done panto, never mind together!
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Date: 2006-04-27 01:21 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-04-25 05:25 am (UTC)Erm... just thought I'd say that I can't wait to see it and hope that idiot SciFi picks up the 2nd season.
Gary got me hooked on it, you know. Then I find out (I really never did pay *any* attention to all those Dr. Who posts on the FDAS, so this explains it) that Chris Eccleston's replaced by a new guy. Doctor Who's on a run with James Bond, I swear. :-p
So, is the new Doctor and season as cool as the first? ;)
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Date: 2006-04-25 04:53 pm (UTC)Yay, you're enjoying it!! And I'm really hoping that SciFi pick up the 2nd season. They were absolute prats for not taking season 1 when they were first offered it, so they'd have to be dumber than rocks to not grab season 2 the moment the BBC offers it. I wonder whether they've totted up how much revenue they lost by not showing it sooner and forcing most Americans to get tapes from Canada or download illegally?
Gary got me hooked on it, you know.
I must congratulate Gary *nods*
Chris Eccleston's replaced by a new guy. Doctor Who's on a run with James Bond, I swear. :-p
*g* One of the great things with Doctor Who is that they have a canon device for regularly changing their lead actor - it's what allowed it to run for so long originally and how they've managed to pick it up without doing much damage to continuity with the original series. Admittedly Chis Eccleston left a lot sooner than I'd anticipated, but at least they have a way to replace him already established.
So, is the new Doctor and season as cool as the first? ;)
They are :-))) I'm loving the new guy. He's different from CE, who I adored as the Doctor, and he's carving out his own Doctor but he's also picking up bits and pieces from previous incarnations of the Doctor to work in. It helps that David Tennant is a long-time Doctor Who fan so he has a fair idea of what he's walking into!
The second season has so far had two very fun episodes that I've thoroughly enjoyed. I think it's possibly had a stronger start than the first season, which didn't really pick up steam until the third episode, but it's too early to tell whether it's going to match or better some of the later episodes in last year's run. If you haven't reached The Empty Child/The Doctor Dances yet, you're in for a treat - I thought they were the best episodes of the season. Although the finale of the season was only a smidge behind them in quality.
I'm so pleased that you're enjoying Doctor Who :-))
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Date: 2006-04-26 07:35 am (UTC)Very likely why the numbnuts brought it onboard, aside from the money-making value. It was likely pointed out that in refusing to heed to the demand of viewers would likely create a lot of illegal activity--never mind lower ratings for everything else given that they've put Doctor Who on while the other shows are between seasons. It's a good place to start but Doctor Who had *better not* be a filler or I'll be very pissed. Get me addicted to the damn thing and that would happen.
And you know, Gary taped some eps for me on dvd but they're avi files and I don't have software that'll play avi files. ::growls:: I'll have to buy it anyway but this just means I have to wait to see the eps. Ah well.
Admittedly Chis Eccleston left a lot sooner than I'd anticipated, but at least they have a way to replace him already established.
I figured they'd have a plot device installed already. I was actually thinking up one myself.*g*
If you haven't reached The Empty Child/The Doctor Dances yet, you're in for a treat - I thought they were the best episodes of the season.
Ummm... I forget the name of the ep last Friday but it was about the Doctor, Rose, and that idiot BF going 100,000+ years into the future to a news broadcast place called Satellite 5. At the end, the BF is left at home with his mum. Thank god. *g*
I'm so pleased that you're enjoying Doctor Who :-))
I am, I am! ;) But it has a lot to do with EC. I'm not so sure I'll be as drawn to DT but I'll give him a chance, providing I'm given the chance to see season 2.
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Date: 2006-04-26 08:39 am (UTC)Quite honestly, they'd have to be nuts to treat Doctor Who like that and not pick up season 2 as soon as it's available to them. I understand that the viewing figures have been very good despite the number of people who had already seen it through some method or other and they'd probably be even better for the second season, particularly if they announce ahead of time that they'll be showing it and some people decide to wait before downloading. I know that there are a lot of people who had already watched it through downloads but are enjoying seeing it on TV at scheduled times :-)
I figured they'd have a plot device installed already. I was actually thinking up one myself.*g*
*g* I'd be interested to hear what you've got thought up! CE is the ninth actor to play the Doctor so they've got the plot device well established and it's a very good one, but I'd be interested to know what you've come up with :-)
At the end, the BF is left at home with his mum. Thank god. *g*
Yup, definitely a thank god moment there :-) I was horridly concerned that I'd attempt to keep him. Nasty little brat.
I know exactly where you are and you've only got one more episode before hitting The Empty Child. And the next episode you'll see is very good.
One thing that I've really been enjoying is the way that RTD occasionally sneaks in some subtext that you don't really expect in this kind of show - I loved the not so subtle references to the stupidity of the Iraq war in the Slitheen episodes :-) I sat there going "Did he really just do that or was I reading stuff into that?", but he actually did. Which was great.
And this is one of the few shows where the main het ship is something that I can actually see on screen and works because of the chemistry between the leads. That makes quite a difference from so many other shows (naming no names but looking rather pointedly...)
I'm not so sure I'll be as drawn to DT but I'll give him a chance, providing I'm given the chance to see season 2.
I've got my fingers crossed for season 2. I wasn't entirely sure how I'd feel about DT, but so far I'm really enjoying his Doctor and I'm glad that they picked him when CE decided not to do the second season. I would have loved it if CE had decided to do a couple more seasons (I've been a fan of his since he was in Cracker), but DT is working well so far.
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Date: 2006-04-26 09:48 am (UTC)Well, these are the people who gave up on Farscape. They also sold out First Wave and Invisible Man. Sci-Fi had made commitments of 3 seasons for First Wave and 2 seasons for Invisible Man but wanted out of the contracts. In order to make sure the series failed, they torpedoed them by their constant interference and bad feelings spread around, which ended up with shoddily written season 2 and 3 episodes. Damn shame. Fortunately, they can't mess with Doctor Who, but they can pull the show. I'm hoping they signed a contract they can't get out of or interefere with.
*g* I'd be interested to hear what you've got thought up!
Probably nowhere near the real deal. If I'd had to come up with something, the appearance alteration would've been part of the Time Lord's abilities. He could change his appearance through one of his machines inside the Tardis, either after pre-determined period of traveling time... or whenever he's gotten bored with how he looks. *gg* So, what's he really do? ;)
I sat there going "Did he really just do that or was I reading stuff into that?", but he actually did. Which was great.
;) I always find social/political commentary in what the Doctor does. I even found it on Satellite 5. ;)
And this is one of the few shows where the main het ship is something that I can actually see on screen and works because of the chemistry between the leads.
I... am resisting this ship. She's too young for me to be able to see him with CE. When DT comes along, and I've seen the pics, he might be a better fit. But I'm still resisting. Both men just feel more gay to me than straight. I think that's my slash side tho. :-p
That makes quite a difference from so many other shows (naming no names but looking rather pointedly...)
LMAO!!! Do tell! :-p
I would have loved it if CE had decided to do a couple more seasons (I've been a fan of his since he was in Cracker), but DT is working well so far.
THAT's where I've seen him! I thought he looked familiar but I figured I was only imagining things.*g* Hmmmm... I need to rent that series, been a long time since I've seen it. ::wanders off to Netflix::
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Date: 2006-04-26 01:50 pm (UTC)They'd be complete idiots with no idea of good demographics if they did. The audience numbers should be enough to pursuade them and they will get no input on the show's direction. Although I am wondering what they'll make of Captain Jack when he appears...
f I'd had to come up with something, the appearance alteration would've been part of the Time Lord's abilities.
*ggg* You're actually not too far off the mark there. Sure you really want to know? :-)
Both men just feel more gay to me than straight. I think that's my slash side tho. :-p
Possibly :-) The description that I feel fits best with Rose and the Doctor is that she loves him at a deeper level than the physical. That's certainly how they're playing it, although I can see the physical side coming through more with DT. I do like the idea that they're so connected and close because it contrasts so much with her relationship with Mickey.
As for the Doctor....after nine hundred years I'd say he's rather flexible in his sexuality :-) That's possibly what your slashy side is picking up on ;-)
I need to rent that series, been a long time since I've seen it. ::wanders off to Netflix::
I've just been thinking the same thing. Cracker was a great series. Not be American-bashing, but I though it was far superior to the American take off.
You may be interested to know that they're doing a one-off Cracker this year. I'm hoping that it measures up to the original episodes. They've got the old cast back so it should be interesting.
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Date: 2006-04-26 10:18 pm (UTC)Who's Captain Jack? I can't help but see Captain Jack Sparrow. ::desk::
Sure you really want to know? :-)
Nooooooooo, I'll wait. ::drums fingers:: :-p
I do like the idea that they're so connected and close because it contrasts so much with her relationship with Mickey.
Hmmmm. Yes. I'd characterize that as Doctor/Rose = Mature and Rose/Mickey = Immature. The lads she's had, including the one in the first ep, were a bit... well, they matched her age, I guess, but not her mind, if you see what I mean.
As for the Doctor....after nine hundred years I'd say he's rather flexible in his sexuality :-) That's possibly what your slashy side is picking up on ;-)
Probably. *Dreadful* tease he is (in a good way, I mean *gg*)
I've just been thinking the same thing. Cracker was a great series. Not be American-bashing, but I though it was far superior to the American take off.
Not American-bashing there. ::hangs head:: The British crime series, et al, should not be messed with. Be it Helen Mirren's series (god, there goes my memory again because I can't bloody remember the damn title), or Spooks (which they renamed MI5 over here), Sea of Souls, Second Sight or Wire in the Blood(my favorite).
I love Robert Pastorelli (American Cracker) but not as Cracker. He's *NOT* Robbie Coltrane and Cracker isn't Cracker unless he's in Britain, that's all there is to it. ;)
You may be interested to know that they're doing a one-off Cracker this year. I'm hoping that it measures up to the original episodes. They've got the old cast back so it should be interesting.
Hee! That's great! Except... I'll have to add two years to that and I may just be able to see the thing. ::thud::
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Date: 2006-04-27 09:09 am (UTC)You'll have to wait until The Empty Child. But I will say that he's an absolutely fabulous character and I dearly hope that SciFi don't try to mess around or cut anything 'cos that would be very mean. And he is in the icon used for this reply :-)
Nooooooooo, I'll wait. ::drums fingers:: :-p
*snicker* Sometimes patience can pay off.
well, they matched her age, I guess, but not her mind, if you see what I mean.
I definitely see what you mean and I think that's why I'm able to see a ship between her and the Doctor. Even if you can't see the shipping aspects, that deep admiration, love and respect that they have going is a huge part of what makes their interactions so watchable. Rose seemed to be stifled in her life on the estate before meeting the Doctor because the people around her couldn't get her on that level. The Doctor can and travelling with him has allowed her to grow beyond her background, if that makes sense.
*Dreadful* tease he is (in a good way, I mean *gg*)
*snort*
Be it Helen Mirren's series (god, there goes my memory again because I can't bloody remember the damn title),
Prime Suspect. And they're also doing another one of those this year - the last one, they've announced, because the character is now getting to retirement age. So add two years and you'll hopefully get to see that, too.
He's *NOT* Robbie Coltrane and Cracker isn't Cracker unless he's in Britain, that's all there is to it. ;)
Quite right ::nods:: Leaving aside the fact that the Americans couldn't allow their Fitz to have the faults that Robbie Coltrane's Fitz did, a lot of the backgrounds and ideas in the story-lines work best set in Britain.
In fact, all the shows you named couldn't be transposed to America without losing what makes them interesting and unique (not that that stops people trying...). I enjoy American detective/cop shows like Law and Order or CSI because of the way they're done - those couldn't be transported over here without losing what makes them good, either. I like the variety of watching things from Britain and from America because we come at these things from different angles and do different things.
I'll have to add two years to that and I may just be able to see the thing. ::thud::
Not to be obnoxious, but now you know how we feel about some of your shows ;-p~~~ But it is darned annoying that we don't get simultaneous releases of some of these things.
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Date: 2006-04-27 10:20 am (UTC)::thud:: Niiiiiiiiiice icon. And for a second, from that angle, he reminded me of Antonio Sabato Jr. Only younger. :-p Doesn't matter though. Yummy. ;)
Rose seemed to be stifled in her life on the estate before meeting the Doctor because the people around her couldn't get her on that level. The Doctor can and travelling with him has allowed her to grow beyond her background, if that makes sense.
It makes perfect sense. She's highly intelligent and he wouldn't have invited her along if she hadn't been. She matches him, personality and brains. ;) I can't see ship--mostly because I'm refusing to ship anything male/female as I resent it occuring to me in the first place. Remember that convo we had a long way back, about how we resent having a Ship pairing thrust in our faces? It's why I'm resisting Rose and the Doctor. I don't like to Ship them simply because they're both dynamic, amazing characters. I think they can love without having the romantic crap thrown in there. Now, if Captain Jack is a nicely gay character... my mind will go there at warp 15. :-p
Quite right ::nods:: Leaving aside the fact that the Americans couldn't allow their Fitz to have the faults that Robbie Coltrane's Fitz did, a lot of the backgrounds and ideas in the story-lines work best set in Britain.
Exactly. If they tried Cracker now, with all the faults in place, it would fly. But I think they learned their lesson. Or I hope they did. Cracker is a British cop. Period.
I like the variety of watching things from Britain and from America because we come at these things from different angles and do different things.
Me, too. And I've been addicted to British-run features and television since I was ten years old and saw them on our PBS (Public Broadcasting System, where--before cable--I got to see I Claudius, The Six Wives of Henry the VIII, and Elizabeth R). Python came later, when the censorship got over itself.
Not to be obnoxious, but now you know how we feel about some of your shows ;-p~~~ But it is darned annoying that we don't get simultaneous releases of some of these things.
I know. :( It's totally unfair, but they each run their little empires by their own screwing clocks and to hell with what the viewers actually want. Ratings my ass.
no subject
Date: 2006-04-27 01:33 pm (UTC)*g*
She matches him, personality and brains. ;)
Exactly. That's not something we've seen before in the Doctor's companions and it works so well for these guys.
I'm particularly impressed by Billie Piper's acting, portraying Rose like this, because I hadn't been sure that she had it in her. I first encountered her as one of those teeny bopper singers a few years ago - dreadful songs that were sadly popular. Her acting abilities continue to surprise me each week.
It's why I'm resisting Rose and the Doctor.
I can understand your POV. It's interesting, because your motivations are why I'm finding it so fun to ship them - I've got a 'canon' ship that actually works because of the characters rather than having a canon ship forced on me with characters that have no spark or energy between them *shrugs* It's cool to see how differently our minds work on this.
I think they can love without having the romantic crap thrown in there.
I definitely think it's possible and it's the other reading of their relationship that I'm really enjoying. To be honest, I'm not terribly interested in finding romantic or smutty Doctor/Rose fanfic because it's the deeper relationship that is much more interesting. I guess that I'm seeing a certain amount of UST in their relationship mixed in with all the deeper feelings and I'm loving watching it. Having that UST acted on, IMO, would take some of that interest away for me.
I never thought that I'd agree with
Now, if Captain Jack is a nicely gay character... my mind will go there at warp 15. :-p
*snicker* Just wait a week or two...
;-)
I got to see I Claudius, The Six Wives of Henry the VIII, and Elizabeth R
You've managed to see some of our top classic TV series. Although we have some fairly dire stuff (just like every country, I suspect) there are some genres that we do incredibly well and it's great to see Americans appreciating that.
Ratings my ass.
Too true. They don't care much about the actual ratings, but more about whether the ratings are the kind that the advertisers want which is a whole different things. Damn them.
no subject
Date: 2006-04-27 10:26 pm (UTC)Ah, a British Britney? Only with better class.
*shrugs* It's cool to see how differently our minds work on this.
Actually, I see your point. Because there's no canon ship, it's much easier to place them together.
But here's a dreadful thought... what if we ever get canon slash on a show? Are we then going to be hating that? I have to say no, not simply because it's canon.
With canon ship, I tend to resist it simply because of that godawful illogical crap they threw at us on SG-1. It's affected every other shipping possibility for me. I *do* agree that Rose and The Doctor have something there, but unlike you, I don't see any UST. I see him being lonely and wanting a friend with brains to match his own. I think he's found one in her. I *can* see the possibility of ship, but my slash side wants him with a nice lookin' fella. ;)
**Now, if Captain Jack is a nicely gay character... my mind will go there at warp 15. :-p**
*snicker* Just wait a week or two...
??? Is this the series where I heard a male character kissed the Doctor? If so... ::hypervenilates::
Although we have some fairly dire stuff (just like every country, I suspect)
::hangs head:: I think we outperformed every other country on the planet by the releases of The Man Show and Jackass. Trust me, if you haven't heard of them, be very glad. They bring sexism and stupid male shit (respectively) to a whole new level. I've seen Ed vs. Spencer. We've sadly gone past that, I think. :( Edward R. Murrow is turning in his grave.
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Date: 2006-04-30 05:33 pm (UTC)I think that's what makes this ship different from ship ala SG-1 - we can actually *see* it there as a possibility, even if we prefer other pairings for other reasons. Ship in shows like SG-1 irritate me because there is nothing deeper on the screen to base it on. No matter how many "longing looks" they foist on us, there is very little in the canon to persuade me that Sam and Jack have a deeper connection or even a real frienship, which makes the ship so hard to swallow. Whether or not you choose to be a shipper with Rose and the Doctor, there is at least a deeper relationship there to play with that might be a basis for the ship.
what if we ever get canon slash on a show? Are we then going to be hating that? I have to say no, not simply because it's canon.
I think that canon slash on a show needs the same things that canon ship needs to keep me watching, believing and wanting it - some deeper relationship that I can see than the producers just inserting a few random longing looks and telling us that it's canon. If you put in that deeper texture to the relationship, then a pairing will work in canon whether it's ship or slash.
??? Is this the series where I heard a male character kissed the Doctor? If so... ::hypervenilates::
Try not to pass out, hon ;-)))
no subject
Date: 2006-04-30 07:42 pm (UTC)It's detrimental to the characters as well as illogical. Both are military, with Sam being even more career-driven than Jack. To foist her on the Ship bus is just insulting all the career women out there. To then have her consistently call him "Sir," and Jack act bothered when she calls him by his name... it's contradictory and dysfunctional, never mind offensive.
Whether or not you choose to be a shipper with Rose and the Doctor, there is at least a deeper relationship there to play with that might be a basis for the ship.
I watched "Father's Day" on Friday and I saw a bit more love there than I had before. That deep sort of love. There may not be any sex between them, in my slashy mind, but their holding hands seems to say a lot, add that the Doctor is a man who's not afraid to show his feelings and I really like that. ;)
some deeper relationship that I can see than the producers just inserting a few random longing looks and telling us that it's canon. If you put in that deeper texture to the relationship, then a pairing will work in canon whether it's ship or slash.
Very true. And imo, without that deeper connection, or at least a matching of minds, any sexual relationship foisted on them ends up looking more like a porn relationship, het or slash.
Try not to pass out, hon ;-)))
::dances:: Hee!
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Date: 2006-05-01 04:51 pm (UTC)It does - there's a sense of connection and trust there and this episode really brought it out. It's a really good episode if you like the emotional stuff (which I do) and I liked the conflicts in it - should Rose tell her Dad who she is and the Doctor's pain at seeing what's happening to her. Also the Doctor knowing what has to happen to put this right. I even liked his anger at her actions - after what happened with Adam in the previous episode, to have Rose do what she did had to hurt.
And imo, without that deeper connection, or at least a matching of minds, any sexual relationship foisted on them ends up looking more like a porn relationship, het or slash.
Exactly.
no subject
Date: 2006-05-01 08:08 pm (UTC)And.... I think we're done with this thread--it's getting cramped over here. *gg* Will attack another Doctor thread. ;)